CNN "State of the Union" - Transcript: Interview with Tennessee Senator Bob Corker

Interview

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TAPPER: Hello. I'm Jake Tapper in Washington, where the state of our union is chaotic, with fears that it's all about to get much worse. If President Trump was looking for a dramatic season finale, he's got

it, government shutdown, top officials quitting in protest, a plummeting stock market. And there's still a week of 2018 to go.

Saturday, President Trump announced that he and Melania will celebrate Christmas in Washington this year, instead of at Mar-a-Lago. They will not be able to gaze upon the normally spectacularly adorned National Christmas Tree, however. The government shutdown means it's lights out for the large evergreen near the White House, as the government seems almost sure to remain partially closed through the holiday.

Congress will not resume official business until Thursday, with no deal in sight, leaving federal workers facing uncertainty over the holiday. Some 380,000 employees will stay home until the government reopens, while about 420,000 employees deemed essential will be forced to work without pay.

A reminder, most federal employees do not live in the Washington, D.C., area. They live throughout the country.

Saturday, lawmakers and members of the president's team appeared to remain at an impasse, with no signs of a path forward. Republican Senator Leader Mitch McConnell announcing nothing will happen until the president and Democrats agree.

President Trump is demanding $5 billion for his border wall, and Senate Democrats say they will not give him the votes for it, this as the president seems to be even less restrained than normal, after the sudden resignations of his defense secretary, Jim Mattis, and Brett McGurk, a top diplomatic official in the fight against ISIS, moves that have even some of the most loyal Republicans expressing misgivings and concern.

I want to go straight to the chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, Senator Bob Corker, Republican of Tennessee.

Senator, thanks so much for joining us. We appreciate it.

SEN. BOB CORKER (R), TENNESSEE: Jake, good to be with you during these festive times.

(LAUGHTER)

TAPPER: That's right. Merry Christmas.

You were heavily involved in the negotiations. You helped secure a deal requiring all the parties involved, Pelosi, Ryan, Schumer, McConnell, and President Trump, to publicly agree before a vote to end the shutdown.

I have to say, I found it striking the part of this deal was that President Trump needs to publicly endorse it before there's any vote.

Why? CORKER: Well, look, Jake, this is a purposely contrived fight over,

at the end of the day, even no matter who wins, our borders are still going to be insecure.

I think you know that, back in 2013, John Hoeven and I crafted a border security amendment that passed was 69 votes in a Senate where Republicans were in the minority. I'm a junior senator from Tennessee. And 69 people voted for $46 billion to secure our border.

It was overly prescriptive, and it was overkill, but our borders would have been secure. Not long ago, just a few months ago, the president could have received $25 billion in border security just by dealing with the dreamers, which, by the way, most Republicans want to deal with the dreamers issue.

So, we had $25 billion that could have been spent on border security. Now the government is shut down over what ultimately is going to be $2 billion. This is a made-up fight, so the president can look like he's fighting.

But, even if he wins, our borders are going to be insecure. And part of it is because of what we're spending the money on. We have all kinds of technology, as you know, that we can use to secure the borders. The $46 billion did include 700 miles of fencing, which was important.

[09:05:02]

But there's all kinds of technology that we use in Iraq and Afghanistan to secure our borders. And so it's not unlike going to the Pentagon and saying, look, we need to buy fighters, and we have stealth fighters, and they're supersonic, and they have precision- guided missiles, but, no, let's -- let's use the Wright Brothers.

And so this -- it's not just about the money. It's about what we're spending in on.

TAPPER: So...

CORKER: We could secure our borders. We could solve this problem. This is a made-up fight.

And I would just tell citizens across our country that, turn this off, but focus on the significant things, the fact that we just announced we're pulling out of Syria...

TAPPER: Yes, I want to get to that in a second.

CORKER: ... something that is -- yes, go ahead.

TAPPER: I'm going to get one second, but let me just -- I just want to just understand this.

You're saying that President Trump, if he wants that money for the border wall, for border security, he can get it, but he needs to make a deal, but he doesn't want to make a deal, he just wants a campaign issue. Am I hearing you correctly?

CORKER: It has to be that, because this is -- this is like falling off a table.

The Democrats easily would support more border funding, border security. They have said that; 25 of them came to the floor and voted for something that provided $25 billion worth of border security, in exchange for dealing with the dreamers.

And Republicans want to deal with the dreamers. So, this is something that is unnecessary. It's a spectacle. And, candidly, it's juvenile. The whole thing is juvenile. I want to see real border security. And that's why I'm disappointed at where we have ended up at the end of this Congress.

TAPPER: I want to turn to foreign policy.

The president tweeted about his defense secretary, James Mattis, yesterday. Mattis obviously resigned following the president's announcement he's pulling all U.S. troops from Syria.

In his resignation letter, Mattis made it very clear he disagrees with the president when it comes to Mattis having respect for allies and alliances, that he thinks that China and Russia are bad actors.

What was your reaction to it all?

CORKER: Look, I'm -- I'm saddened.

We have been working with allies. There are some 60 coalition groups that are working with us. The SDF, which is made up of Kurds and Arabs, have been doing the fighting for us. We have been helping them do what they're doing, but they're the ones that are doing the fighting.

We're in the final stages. ISIS is now concentrated in the Euphrates River Valley. We're just a few months away from finishing something that we started, where we would annihilate a large number of ISIS members.

And we stopped. I'm just saddened for our country. I'm saddened for the broken relationships with countries that have been with us. I'm saddened for the many Kurds and others that likely will be -- will be killed and slaughtered by the Syrians or the Turks.

I'm saddened for our country in being so unreliable. There are number of, as you know, foreign fighters that are there as prisoners. What do we do with them? Do they go back to countries? Do we release them?

I'm -- I'm devastated by this. And I think that what Mattis did was very important for our country, because for some of these machinations that we see coming out of 1600 Pennsylvania, people realize they don't really matter. This one matters.

TAPPER: Yes. CORKER: This one matters to our country. It matters to our foreign

interests. This matters to our citizens.

TAPPER: Senator, the president also tweeted yesterday about Brett McGurk. He's the top U.S. diplomat in the fight against ISIS, who announced he's going to leave his post early.

The president tweeted -- quote -- "Brett McGurk, who I do not know, was appointed by President Obama in 2015, was supposed to leave in February, but he just resigned prior to leaving. Grandstander? The fake news is making such a big deal about this nothing event."

Now, in point of fact, obviously, Brett McGurk was working for George W. Bush before he was working for Obama. But, to the point that the president brings up in this, he doesn't know the special presidential envoy for the Global Coalition to Defeat ISIS?

CORKER: Yes, so -- you know, I would not be surprised if they have not had a meeting.

He is a real talent. I have met with him many times. We have all dealt with him through the years. And he was leaving in February.

But, as Mattis just did, one of the greatest patriots I have ever met in our -- in my public service, General Mattis -- but, as Mattis did, he followed suit and left.

And he did the right thing. So, I don't look at that as grandstanding. He's been an important person to us. Obviously, the secretary of defense is in a higher role and much higher-profile position and much more important, but Brett has played an important role for our country.

I thank him for his service. I thank him for dealing with the most difficult issue. And I wish him well as he moves on.

TAPPER: Well, listen to this, Senator Corker. This is something you said more than a year ago about President Trump and what some people called the axis of grownups.

[09:10:05]

Take a listen.

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TAPPER: Tillerson was fired via Twitter. Mattis and Kelly are going to be leaving in the coming days and months.

First of all, it's hard to imagine that the last year is the year without chaos, but should we expect even more chaos than we have already been experiencing, given the lack of these three men in the administration?

CORKER: Yes, so, look, I had a lot of respect for these three gentlemen and some who've come on since.

I think what's happened, really, about three or four or five months ago, I noticed a real change. And I don't think that -- I doubt there's anybody that really can -- I think the president has felt that: Look, I have got this now. Input from people like this is much less relevant to me. I have got this under control.

So, I think we're just in a -- in a whole different period now. When you have got Secretary Pompeo, John Bolton, General Mattis laying out all the problems that occur -- could occur with a precipitous decision like was tweeted out about Syria, and yet it still happens, I think you're at a place now where we're beyond that.

And, again, some devastating decisions are being made, even with people giving strong input in the opposite direction. So, I don't know what to say about it.

Jake, I have done as much as I can as a senator -- I'm leaving soon -- to point out all the problems with this type of decision-making. Now we're into something that's incredibly sober as it relates to Syria and possibly Afghanistan coming soon.

And, somehow or another, I hope that the president will see fit to make some decisions here that are not -- not ultimately devastating to our country.

TAPPER: What do you say to the person sitting at home who thinks, you know what, we have been in Afghanistan forever, we can't be in Syria forever?

I'm sure President Trump came in, gave the generals some time, said, OK, you have a year, OK, you have another year.

CORKER: Yes.

TAPPER: And then, ultimately, he's just like, we're never going to have -- we're never going to get out of these wars. These are forever wars. And we can't just fight them indefinitely. So, even if I don't like the manner in which he's doing it, I support President Trump ending these foreign wars, ending these foreign entanglements.

What -- what do you say to those voters?

CORKER: Well, we got 28,000 troops in the DMZ between South and North Korea. They're not in harm's way, but they're still there.

In Syria, I mean, this was a very low-cost situation for us to continue to rout out Syria and to rout out ISIS, but also to keep in check what's happening there with Russia and Iran. So -- so -- and the fact is, we were coming to a close. At some point, obviously, we were going to leave Syria. But to leave it when you're within a couple of months of doing something that is very important in the fight against ISIS -- and the president knows that -- and we pull the -- jerk the rug out from under two months in advance, that's hard to understand.

As it relates to Afghanistan, no doubt, I mean -- and we have made a lot of mistakes there. A lot of resources went from Afghanistan to Iraq in the early years. And I saw it happening on the ground, visiting.

So, yes, we have been there a long, long time. But there are ways of leaving and ways of leaving. And, again, this is precipitous. It appears to me that some changes are taking place as to the way we're looking at Afghanistan. And, yes, we're negotiating with the very people that we went there to take out.

So, I understand the frustrations with Afghanistan. I do. I do not understand, I have no understanding of what we did -- why we did what we did in Syria. It just totally boggles any sane thinking that could take place, boggles. I don't understand it.

TAPPER: You were actually at the White House on Wednesday after the president made his announcement to withdraw from Syria.

But, before you could speak with the president, he canceled the meeting. What happened there?

CORKER: I don't know. I think he had no public events that day.

I think the incoming -- obviously, our conversation had evolved to be -- it was going to be all about Syria. And I just don't think that was a topic on that day. I think he -- I think he knows that he's made a mistake. I do.

[09:15:00]

The president's tendencies are to dig in and double down, even if he knows he's done something that probably is incorrect. And so I don't think he wanted to talk about Syria that day. And so the meeting was called off. And that's what happened.

TAPPER: This week, you told "The New York Times" about President Trump -- quote -- "I question whether he runs again. He's having difficulty handling the situation."

Why do you think the president might not run again?

CORKER: Well, I -- look, I look at just what's happening economically this week. You know, I don't know. I mean, look, we will see.

This next quarter, I -- I'm glad -- I'm glad, Jake, I'm so privileged to have been able to serve in the Senate for 12 years. And I really am. And that's what I told the people of our state I would do, is serve for two terms. I do wish I was serving for 12 months -- 12 years and three months. I

do think this next three months is going to be a very important three months for our country. I'm cheering the guys on that are there.

But I think this next three months could well determine whether he decides to run again or not. I think it's going to be very important for our country that the United States Senate really dig in and make sure we don't make other colossal mistakes as it relates to foreign policy.

But I think there's a -- I think the stage is going to be set. And we will see. Again, only he knows what he's going to do next, but we will see. Very important three months coming up, though.

TAPPER: Do you want him to run for reelection in 2020?

CORKER: Oh, I -- that's -- it's -- it doesn't matter what I want or don't want. That's something he will have to decide.

TAPPER: Senator Corker, we have always enjoyed having you on the show. And even though you're leaving the U.S. Senate, we hope you will not be a stranger.

And I wish you the very most merry of Christmases for you and your family.

CORKER: Thank you so much.

It's been quite a privilege to work with you and others. And I wish you the very best during this momentous time in our country and meaningful time for families at home, I hope.

Thank you.

TAPPER: Thank you, Senator Corker. Appreciate it.

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